Does Control 4 X4 mean that Siri/Apple is the supported path to full Voice Control?

[cnicholson]

“Full HomeKit integration” seems to mean two-way.   Pop a HomePod Mini anywhere, tell C4 what Room it’s in and, boom, we could have full room-aware voice control, with further tweaks as to device naming, programming, etc. available on the C4 and/or HomeKit side.   Halo mic would be the other input device for this.  Perhaps even an always-listening while docked” mode.

If true, I hope they get some special access to Apple APIs to enable something like addressing a HomePod with “Siri play some Beatles” and having the sound come out of the C4-controlled A/V in the same room.   A limitation of the HomeKit drivers I have seen is that Media commands are “reserved” for native Apple Ecosystem.  Getting around this could be an opportunity to make C4 + HomePods much more “Josh.ai like.”

Speculating a bit here, but seems likely (to me) that this is the direction.

[zaphod]

I wouldn't go that far.  Apple has never made it easy for third parties to be part of their ecosystem, and I don't think that they are radically changing their philosophy on this.

[Cyknight]

44 minutes ago, cnicholson said:

“Full HomeKit integration” seems to mean two-way

Seems and are do not equal each other. AFAIK, from what little info there is, we're talking using Siri as a voiceinput only. You're lookng at integration similar to alexa/google as best I can tell at this point.

[cnicholson]

I hear you guys, but I note that we already have full Siri *input* capability via Halo and AppleTV.   Right now, you can grab your Halo remote and voice control most of your HomeKit ecosystem via C4.  To control C4 native devices, you need third party HomeKit drivers/bridges.  I am imagining that this “bridge” function will become native.   That would not require Apple to change anything.   The next step of letting HomePods give up reserved media control commands *would* require Apple to change things and I agree this is less likely.  But the stated promise of “seamless HomeKit integration” implies at least providing the “bridge” function out-of-the-box, no? 

[ticketsubmitter]

It has already been confirmed that your C4 devices will appear in HomeKit but not vice-versa because this is one way.

[Cyknight]

1 hour ago, cnicholson said:

but I note that we already have full Siri *input* capability via Halo

Halo is just a voice passthrough device, this is nothing like Alexa or Google home voice control. Using halo plus appleTV plus homekit is kind of a mashed up way to get something like using your phone to control a homekit.

Alexa/google is using voice to control items in your Control4 system. I expect this to be all you can expect homekit integration to be. Use voice/siri via a homekit setup to turn lights on and off etc.

I would expect nothing more than that, nothing close to Josh - and as mentioned it was already stated that it's one-way so no there is no intrgation of homekit connected 'other' devices back to control4.

In essence, via homekit, you can now (well .. later) have Siri try to do what Alexa and Google pods already do.

[cnicholson]

Oh well.  Still some progress I guess.  I was hoping that new HomeKit stuff would make me not feel bitter about the subscription model.  I guess I’ll have to fall in love with widgets instead.  LOL.

[Control4Savant]

Even Savant thats programmed and hosted on Macs has similar integration limits 

[ChzBurger]

Apple is fully on board with Matter. Matter will be the way for multi-controller integration. Apple could even become a Matter bridge. Matter only relies on software to control (needs a Bluetooth connection to onboard). It works well now for simple devices like switches and dimmers. Maybe a Matter announcement will come from C4 sooner rather than later. Users should have higher expectations if Connect is going to be mandatory.

[Cyknight]

2 hours ago, ChzBurger said:

Apple is fully on board with Matter. Matter will be the way for multi-controller integration. Apple could even become a Matter bridge. Matter only relies on software to control (needs a Bluetooth connection to onboard). It works well now for simple devices like switches and dimmers. Maybe a Matter announcement will come from C4 sooner rather than later. Users should have higher expectations if Connect is going to be mandatory.

Yeah Matter really doesn't matter and I doubt it will. That said the ZigBee alliance is aligned with Matter, so if it ever does become a thing...well C4 is part of that alliance already.

[ChzBurger]

17 minutes ago, Cyknight said:

That said the ZigBee alliance is aligned with Matter

Matter devices work reliably today, including within the Apple Home world. But not on Control4. It's a young infrastructure, so there are still growing pains, especially for things more complicated than the basics.

There is no more Zigbee Alliance. It renamed itself "Connectivity Standards Alliance". Matter is built on a lot of Zigbee technology and Zigbee standards are part of the organization. Resideo is at the top promoter level, so there is some awareness within the C4 world.

Edited Tuesday at 03:26 PM by ChzBurger
clarity

[Cyknight]

45 minutes ago, ChzBurger said:

Matter devices work reliably today, including within the Apple Home world. But not on Control4. It's a young infrastructure, so there are still growing pains, especially for things more complicated than the basics.

There is no more Zigbee Alliance. It renamed itself "Connectivity Standards Alliance". Matter is built on a lot of Zigbee technology and Zigbee standards are part of the organization. Resideo is at the top promoter level, so there is some awareness within the C4 world.

Yes, Control4 is a participant in that alliance, and Residio a propmoter. Like I said, the ZigBee alliance is heavily involved in Matter, indeed to the point that they rebranded and essentially BECAME the Matter alliance.

Matter has stalled in phenomenal fashion, devices are NOT working 'across the board; and are not 'just working' and do not 'get all their features everywhere'.

If Matter ends up working, great - but the problem with a 'cross manufacturer protocol' is the always the same: many manufacturers will say they support it, but don't bother to actually support it.

Understand that I have nothing against Matter in principal: it'd be great to have an industry wide, indeed industry overlapping, protocol. I'm just not holding my breath for something to work that has (as a principal) failed time and time again and for the same reason every time.

 

I certainly wouldn't hold my breath to somehow see Apple (Homekit) all of a sudden being the great 'device' that makes it all happen. Let alone it being some direct value with C4 (or any other similar system).

An open protocol, that is free (well sort of) being driven by the historically most closed off manufacturer? Well it could happen.

 

[zaphod]

There are so many things that could be useful if stuff did all come together.  Like integrating AirTags into C4 for geofencing, etc.  But there are too many vested interests that will keep the HA world from moving into the best end state for users.

IMO music is the one area where we have a great end state for users.  For about $10-15/month you can get all the music that you could ever get on any device and listen to anywhere.

The world of video and HA are not going in this direction as too many people seem to have too much to loose.

[ChzBurger]

That's where Matter, er, matters. Multi-platform use is real today. It's not currently perfect and it is possible to screw up. Remember that the standards are supported by device makers too. They want their devices to be usable on more than one platform. If Matter lives up to expectations controller makers won't be able to use device compatibility as a competitive advantage much, if at all, outside their own proprietary devices. Meaning the controller makers can & need to focus on how well their controllers control & automate devices.

And geofencing is a common feature among consumer-level systems including Apple. Even Lutron puts it in their mediocre phone apps. Not sure why C4 relies on 3rd party work arounds. Maybe X4. 

[Cyknight]

39 minutes ago, ChzBurger said:

as a competitive advantage much, if at all, outside their own proprietary devices

Apple. Nuff said.

40 minutes ago, ChzBurger said:

Remember that the standards are supported by device makers too

As are/were every other standard/set of standards.

 

Again, nothing against the ideal, just not confident in the reality.