Going From a C4 User to A Crestron Dealer

[GoGo Delicious]

Hi All,

As most of you may or may not know, we had a VERY bad experience with our C4 install (you can view my post here regarding our experience here http://www.c4forums.com/viewtopic.php?id=1047). Long story short we hired a C4 dealer/installer to hook up our guest house to see how we would like C4 before we started on our main house. Since we had such a horrible experience with our guest house we decided to go with Crestron in our main house.

Well, when I decied to go with Crestron I was concerned that I was not going to be able to program Crestron. I was able to aquire the latest dealer edition of Compser in order to add/remove system components, etc without having to contact our incompetent dealer. If I went with Crestron I would not be able to do this. So that got me started thinking why dont I become a Crestron dealer OR buy a existing company. So thats just what we did. We bought one of the largest Crestron dealers (based on net revenue) here in So. Cal. I actually did consider becoming a C4 dealer but we could not justify becoming one.

The one thing that I kept hearing was how much more expensive Crestron was compared to C4 and thats just not true. Crestron is a BIT more in cost, what you get in fetures out weighs by far the difference in price.

I am keeping C4 in the guest house for now and starting the Crestron install within the next few days since I am the new owner I do get it at dealer cost and programming is free YAY . I believe C4 is a good product but I truely believe #1) they lack qualified installers as many end users have complained about on here, #2) C4's lack of customer support when it comes to helping the enduser when the dealer C4 recomends screws up and #3) product line. Sure C4 has about 95% less products then Crestron BUT Crestron has been in business a lot longer and at some point C4 may have a strong product line up. But speaking as a end user, I dont want to wait. I want my home done right, right now.

For those of you who have C4 and are not happy wth it I encourage you to take a look at Crestron and what it can do. C4 is not for everyone AND Crestron is not for everyone but it does not hurt to compare NOT only products BUT how the company supports the end user when the dealer does not know what they are doing.

As always this is my 2 Cents. I am sure there are some really GREAT dealers out there, in fact by some of the posts I read some of those GREAT dealers are on this board. C4 makes a good product but not a GREAT product and for some good is good enough and for others good is not good enough.

Whats funny is that if I did not have such a horrible experience I would not have bought a Crestron dealer. Who knew

GoGo Delicious

[stash]

GoGo, if your dealer experience was so bad, why not pick-up C4 as a product line at your new business. This would allow others who are interested to have the experience that you were denied by a poor dealer.

I would have to disagree about Crestron being just a "bit" more expensive. The hardware cost is double (roughly) and that doesn't include custom programming. No need to debate that Crestron is a better product because it is. Point is a good dealer should be able to install a C4 system for half the price of a Crestron system.

Be sure to let us kow how your experience goes.

Best Wishes.

[GoGo Delicious]

GoGo, if your dealer experience was so bad, why not pick-up C4 as a product line at your new business. This would allow others who are interested to have the experience that you were denied by a poor dealer.

C4's product range is VERY limited compared to Crestron. First Off, As I mentioned C4 has about 95% LESS products than Crestron and it has NO products availble for Corporate clients such as boardroom, meeting rooms, conference room automation, etc. 2nd, Going into a business I want do not want to limit what we are able to do. 3rd, brand. More and more as I got deeper into this, C4 does not have the reputation that Crestron has. Thats important for me. 4th didn't want to start from scratch bought a VERY successful business from a sucessful dealer.

I would have to disagree about Crestron being just a "bit" more expensive. The hardware cost is double (roughly) and that doesn't include custom programming. No need to debate that Crestron is a better product because it is. Point is a good dealer should be able to install a C4 system for half the price of a Crestron system.

I will have to disagree with you. Where do you get "The hardware cost is double (roughly)"? This is what I kept hearing from those who are not eduated in Crestron. We can install a system compatible to a C4 entry level system including programming for about the same price as a entry level C4 system

Here is what you will get

1) Crestron MC2W http://www.crestron.com/products/show_products.asp?type=residential&cat=3&subcat=22&id=1168 which is the equiv. of C4's HTC-1B

2) Table Top Wireless Touch Panel 5.7" Color screen Part# ST-1700C http://www.crestron.com/products/show_products.asp?type=residential&cat=1019&subcat=1117&id=1095. Includes rechargeble battery and docking station. C4 has no equiv. they ony have the 10.5" which in my opinion is to big. The Table Top Wireless Touch Panel is a completly programable and customizable remote.

3) Programing for up 6 Components

4) Misc. cables, IR Emmiters, etc.

Package Price $2,499.99 Excluding Sales Tax if applicable.

As you can see Crestron is in the same ball park for entry level systems. Basically in the same price neighborhood but you get a better product.

GoGo Delicious.

[wingzz]

Lets see $499 for a HTC with remote vs $2499 for crestron , yup that seems just close enough for me to switch

[stash]

I will have to disagree with you. Where do you get "The hardware cost is double (roughly)"? This is what I kept hearing from those who are not eduated in Crestron. We can install a system compatible to a C4 entry level system including programming for about the same price as a entry level C4 system

Here is what you will get

1) Crestron MC2W http://www.crestron.com/products/show_products.asp?type=residential&cat=3&subcat=22&id=1168 which is the equiv. of C4's HTC-1B

2) Table Top Wireless Touch Panel 5.7" Color screen Part# ST-1700C http://www.crestron.com/products/show_products.asp?type=residential&cat=1019&subcat=1117&id=1095. Includes rechargeble battery and docking station. C4 has no equiv. they ony have the 10.5" which in my opinion is to big. The Table Top Wireless Touch Panel is a completly programable and customizable remote.

3) Programing for up 6 Components

4) Misc. cables, IR Emmiters, etc.

Package Price $2,499.99 Excluding Sales Tax if applicable.

Couple of quick questions,

1) does the crestron system allow you to control and play a full music library from an attached harddrive

2) how much to add lighting control

3) how much to add HVAC control

4) how much for 2 way communication between the remotes and the system

My experience would be that I could install a C4 system utilizing the new HC 300 and a Mini Touch Screen for $1400 with $300 in programming. For $1700 I get an HD onscreen interface, full 2-way remote, in wall color 2-way touchscreen, full control over my music collection and I can add HVAC control for $299 and lighting automation for $99. The value in C4 is in the economies of scale it can produce. It's not a do it all system, but it is a great entry level control system for the price point. If you think C4 and Crestron are competing for the same market space you are missing the point.

[GoGo Delicious]

Lets see $499 for a HTC with remote vs $2499 for crestron , yup that seems just close enough for me to switch

So you are telling me for $499.99 I can get the following.

HTC

Wireless Touch Screen

Programming for up to 6 components

I hope your not a dealer.

GoGo Delicious

[Kirill]

Guys there are two markets.

One can spend $$$$$ and don't really care what system it is - it must work. These people don't care if it's Creston or C4, if it's 1000$ or 3000$. They don't need care for tools to program it - because their time worth more than it takes to figure it out. When you get into full blown system if a person is new to Home Automation - they'll likely to spend 10K$ on C4 than 50K$ on Creston. I have a friend like this - he don't want to be bothered with figuring out how to connect Wii to his TV.

The other group (people like me) can only spend $$$ on hardware can't afford hiring anyone to do the programming.

[GoGo Delicious]

I will have to disagree with you. Where do you get "The hardware cost is double (roughly)"? This is what I kept hearing from those who are not eduated in Crestron. We can install a system compatible to a C4 entry level system including programming for about the same price as a entry level C4 system

Here is what you will get

1) Crestron MC2W http://www.crestron.com/products/show_products.asp?type=residential&cat=3&subcat=22&id=1168 which is the equiv. of C4's HTC-1B

2) Table Top Wireless Touch Panel 5.7" Color screen Part# ST-1700C http://www.crestron.com/products/show_products.asp?type=residential&cat=1019&subcat=1117&id=1095. Includes rechargeble battery and docking station. C4 has no equiv. they ony have the 10.5" which in my opinion is to big. The Table Top Wireless Touch Panel is a completly programable and customizable remote.

3) Programing for up 6 Components

4) Misc. cables, IR Emmiters, etc.

Package Price $2,499.99 Excluding Sales Tax if applicable.

Couple of quick questions,

1) does the crestron system allow you to control and play a full music library from an attached harddrive

Yes using a NAS

2) how much to add lighting control

Starting at $150.00 includes programming

3) how much to add HVAC control

Starting at $300 including programming

4) how much for 2 way communication between the remotes and the system

Add $200.00

My experience would be that I could install a C4 system utilizing the new HC 300 and a Mini Touch Screen for $1400 with $300 in programming.

First off a few things.

1) The C4 Mini Touch Screen is not a true wireless remote. It is ONLY a wireless communicator. Meaning that it needs to draw power from either POE OR be plugged into a power source. You can not take it from the Living room, to the bedroom, to the dining room with out having to plug it into a outlet or runit over POE. Also the Mini Touch Screen is not programmable you are stuck with the interface that C4 gives you. The Crestron touch screen that I have included in the package is COMPLETELY wireless. It does not need a outside power source or POE. It comes with rechargeable battery and a docking station. Also the Crestron touch screen intrface is customizable. I can add any number of buttons, interface's, etc. I can even make the touch screen look like their TV remote if I wanted to.

2) The Crestron touch screen that I have included in the package can be mounted on the wall when not in use. The wall dock will recharge the the Crestron touch screen and also has the ability to lock the remote in the dock so kids can not remove it. To unlock it you just press a button OR you can put in a passcode.

3) IF, and thats a B I G IF, I wanted to compete on price I can go down to $1,900.00 including programming. So for $200.00 more they get a better system, A MUCH better remote and a better user experieince. If we get a client comming in comparing a C4 system to what we offer I dont have any doubt that we will be able to sell them on the Crestron ESPECIALLY if, and again thats a B I G IF, I lower the price to $1900.00. Would I go down to $1,900.00? It depends. If a customer says $,1900.00 is to much I can get C4 for $1,700.00 the customer is obviously price shopping and has no regard for product and you know, as well as I do that, those customer will Nickle and Dime you and they are NOT worth the price. I would actually referr them to C4.

For $1700 I get an HD onscreen interface, full 2-way remote, in wall color 2-way touchscreen, full control over my music collection and I can add HVAC control for $299 and lighting automation for $99.

I have already addressed above.

If you think C4 and Crestron are competing for the same market space you are missing the point.

I think you are missing the point. I NEVER said anything about C4 and Crestron are competing for the same market space. READ WHAT I WROTE

I said ". . .that I kept hearing was how much more expensive Crestron was compared to C4 and thats just not true. Crestron is a BIT more in cost, but what you get in fetures out weighs by far the difference in price"

I also said "C4 is not for everyone AND Crestron is not for everyone but it does not hurt to compare NOT only products BUT how the company supports the end user when the dealer does not know what they are doing."

I should have actually said "C4 is not for everyone AND Crestron is not for everyone but it does not hurt to compare NOT only products AND PRICING, BUT how the company supports the end user when the dealer does not know what they are doing."

If your a dealer you are going to fight with me tooth and nail regarding price and we can go on forever about pricing. But you can not argue that I give you a good run for your money. Your system is $1,700.00 and I can go down to $1,900.00 and give a better product in terms of quality, reliability and user experience. For $200.00 more Im sure most would take it. You even state that the following "No need to debate that Crestron is a better product because it is". I can also HONESTLY state that I have used both, C4 nd Crestron (once it's installed.) In fact i am thinking of removing my C4 system from our guest house, installing it in our show room so potential clients can actually see and experience the difference between the 2 products.

Crestron is NOT going after the C4 market NO one would ever argue that. What I am saying is that with Crestron I CAN compete with C4 IF I had/want to. I wanted to give a cost that was realistic and compare it to C4. When I look on this board all reference to Crestron pricing states that you can not get crestron for less then 10K, 50K, 100K, etc. I just wanted to say hey, look you can get a GREAT ENTRY level system for ROUGHLY the same price as C4. I NEVER said less than, or at the same price. What I did show was that you dont need to have 10K, or even 5K to get into a Crestron system.

That my friend is the point, which I see that you missed.

GoGo Delicious

[lvs]

OK, what do those of us who want to have some control over our system do with Crestron... not all of us can go buy a Crestron company?

I would hate to have to call my dealer everytime I want to add a lighting scene.

[GoGo Delicious]

OK, what do those of us who want to have some control over our system do with Crestron... not all of us can go buy a Crestron company?

I would hate to have to call my dealer everytime I want to add a lighting scene.

Obviously you did not read any of my posts.

I said multiple times "C4 is not for everyone AND Crestron is not for everyone." Obviously Crestron is not for you.

GoGo Delicious

[tumult]

gogo - congrats on the new purchase! when did you purchase the company and what's the name?

thanks,

tum

[lvs]

Obviously... read your own damn threads... this was important for you too, i guess crestron is not for you either. anyway what do you care at this point. Go pay to promote your company somewhere else... maybe a Crestron forum... you have made your choice.

[GoGo Delicious]

Obviously... read your own damn threads...

My My Johnny . . .aren't we in a huffy. (It appears Johnny is going to be in for a L O N G day at school. Class now pay attention. Especially you Johnny as this posts for you)

this was important for you too

One of two things here. 1) You either do not read very well OR you lack total comprehension, maybe even both who knows. At any rate, I NEVER said, in any of my posts that, having programming control was important. In fact I already chose Crestron when I began to think about programming. Having programming control was NEVER a consideration in my decsion. You need to READ CAREFULLY (Come On Johnny Pay Attention). I said ". . . . when I decided to go with Crestron I was concerned that I was not going to be able to program Crestron." Not very many end users get to actually have access to the dealer software I was luck enough to have access to it. Having programming control was NEVER a decsion when I first chose C4 over Crestron nor was it important now. It became necessary to have programming control due to a incompetent Control4 dealer. If I did not have the software I would have been up a creek like a few Contol4 end users here.

If you read my posts CAREFULY AND PAID ATTENTION you will know that my deciding factor in choosing Crestron for our main house was the frustration of the dealer incompetence I kept running into. In fact if you paid atention to what I wrote in my posts, I even asked if any one knew ANY competent dealers to let me know. My EXACT question was "Dealers - Does anyone know of or can recommend a competent, knowledgeable AND reliable dealer? Im in the Orange County area of Southern California."

i guess crestron is not for you either.

JOHNNY SIT UP AND PAY ATTENTION. NO BACK TALK :mad:

anyway what do you care at this point.

I don't (Ummm Ms. Johnnys mom, Ummm Johnnys problem is that he doesent seem to understand what he's reading. Ummm Kay). I started this post, AS I HAVE STATED ABOVE, as a REALISTIC cost compairison between C4 and Crestron. I stated " I wanted to give a cost that was realistic and compare it to C4. When I look on this board all reference to Crestron pricing states that you can not get crestron for less then 10K, 50K, 100K, etc. I just wanted to say hey, look you can get a GREAT ENTRY level system for ROUGHLY the same price as C4. I NEVER said less than, or at the same price. What I did show was that you dont need to have 10K, or even 5K to get into a Crestron system." I just wanted to give some information to the mis-informed (or deformed) which ever fits . .LOL

Go pay to promote your company somewhere else... maybe a Crestron forum...

(Johnny, you are going to have to stay after school today so I can tutor you on how to read) NO WHERE in this thread OR any thread have I promoted ANYTHING. 1) What's the compnay name that I bought? 2) What do I do EXACTLY for a living? 3) What's my real name for that matter . . .Who cares you ask ? ? EXACTLY. READ JOHNNY READ. I never promoted the company. In case you missed it here it is again (THIS IS WHERE YOU PAY ATTENTION JOHNNY).

1) I gave a simple cost comparison between Control4 and Crestron for a ENTRY LEVEL SYSTEM. AGAIN ENTRY LEVEL. A entry level system from Control4 and Crestron DOES NOT INCLUDE Lighting. Sure they have the ability to do lighting control out of the box but you need additional accessories ie Light switches. Out of the box, ENTRY LEVEL SYSTEMS from Control4 and Crestron do remote control functions thats their basic job. In the cost comparison I wanted to show that you can purchase a ENTRY LEVEL Crestron system and that it's not 50K, 20K, 10K, or even 5K but for under 2K. Whats wrong with a little education, a little bit of price comparison between the 2? THATS ALL MY POST WAS ABOUT.

2) Now Johnny where in my post did you read about me promoting my company? Where did I give out the phone #?, Where did I mention the name? Where did I tell people to trade in there C4 systems and call me for Crestron? Where did I give our web address? Where did I give our email address? (Where did you go wrong Johnny? You were such a good kid.)

3) I have NEVER put down Control4's product in ANY OF MY POSTS. Sure I have mentioned that I have had issues with it and would like to see some things done different but I have never said C4 has a crappy product because they dont. What I did say Johnny was that, from MY EXPERIENCE, C4 has a HORRIBLE dealer system and customer service and thats what made me move from C4 to Crestron. as I said in my post above "Whats funny is that if I did not have such a horrible experience I would not have bought a Crestron dealer. Who knew"

I should have actually wrote "Whats funny is that if I did not have such a horrible DEALER experience I would not have bought a Crestron dealer. Who knew" No where did I say Control4 sucks call me I can give you a better system. (Come on Johnny you can do better look at Susie and how good she can read.)

you have made your choice.

Yes I have made my choice Johnny. My choice is to dismiss you from class early. You had a tuff day, especially in Mr. GoGo Delicious' class. Go home get some rest and get ready for the big game Johnny. I know Susie is looking forward to seeing you start your first game as the new Quarter Back.

As David Lee Roth once said CLASS DISMISSED ! ! ! :cool:

GoGo Delicious

[GoGo Delicious]

gogo - congrats on the new purchase! when did you purchase the company and what's the name?

thanks,

tum

Thanks. I appreciate that. All the docs were signed and the deal was closed on Thursday. As far as the name goes, you didn't read it in my post above? It seems a few people (Namely Johnny) are mad at me for PROMOTING my company.

Actually, since this is a C4 board and I am still a C4 users I dont think giving the company name is the right thing to do. As a professional I feel that would be in bad taste.

GoGo Delicious.

[lvs]

Why be so condescending. I contend you suffer from amnesia or maybe you should go back to school yourself. I guess you spew so much bullshit that you can't remember your own posts uh? Obviously you are the one who didn't like my post and got huffy, after all, you wrote a BS thesis that doesn't prove anything accept that you think you are better than everyone else. Hopefully you will treat your customers better.

take a look...Post #9 in this thread http://www.c4forums.com/viewtopic.php?id=1090. Here it is just in case. Doesn't sound like you had chosen Crestron yet at this point and doesn't it sound like having some control over your system is important? First quote is from rant above, 2nd quote below is from Post #9.

One of two things here. 1) You either do not read very well OR you lack total comprehension, maybe even both who knows. At any rate, I NEVER said, in any of my posts that, having programming control was important. In fact I already chose Crestron when I began to think about programming. Having programming control was NEVER a consideration in my decsion. You need to READ CAREFULLY (Come On Johnny Pay Attention).

No problem. My wife keeps asking em the same thing. She's pushing for Crestron.

My main reason for staying are as follows.

1) I do have access to the software to do all the programming. If I move to Crestron or any other HA system I lose that. I don't want to call the dealer/installer every time I want to make a change, add a new product (AV, Audio, etc), want to add a key pad/switch.

Do I need to say anymore about the credibility or lack thereof of your personal attack, gogo? Good luck with your business, i hope you obtain all the success that you deserve.

[stash]

The one thing that I kept hearing was how much more expensive Crestron was compared to C4 and thats just not true. Crestron is a BIT more in cost

When we received the estimates back we received the following. (I am giving the lowest bids only)

Crestron $8,500

AMX - $7,000

C4 - $5,000

Elan - Never really pursued

After all the demos, quotes and ALOT of discussion with my wife we did decided to go with the C4 system from the dealer that was C4 only for the following reasons.

1) Price - Since this was just the guest house we thought if it didn't work right it would not be a big deal.

2) Move the C4 System - I figured that if it did not work right in the guest house that I may be able to use it in my music studio which is one BIG room

3) If it did work, and the C4 installer said he would Guarantee it would work just as good as the Crestron which was our 2nd choice, we would save $3,500 which is always good.

GoGo has a selective memory guys. The reason he got into C4 was because his Crestron dealer quoted him a similar system for 1.7 times the cost of a C4 system. Then comes back to tell us that Crestron is only a "BIT" more expensive.

[GoGo Delicious]

The one thing that I kept hearing was how much more expensive Crestron was compared to C4 and thats just not true. Crestron is a BIT more in cost

When we received the estimates back we received the following. (I am giving the lowest bids only)

Crestron $8,500

AMX - $7,000

C4 - $5,000

Elan - Never really pursued

After all the demos, quotes and ALOT of discussion with my wife we did decided to go with the C4 system from the dealer that was C4 only for the following reasons.

1) Price - Since this was just the guest house we thought if it didn't work right it would not be a big deal.

2) Move the C4 System - I figured that if it did not work right in the guest house that I may be able to use it in my music studio which is one BIG room

3) If it did work, and the C4 installer said he would Guarantee it would work just as good as the Crestron which was our 2nd choice, we would save $3,500 which is always good.

GoGo has a selective memory guys. The reason he got into C4 was because his Crestron dealer quoted him a similar system for 1.7 times the cost of a C4 system. Then comes back to tell us that Crestron is only a "BIT" more expensive.

Let's educate Stash on the difference between retail and wholesale.

1) The quotes I put above are the RETAIL quotes I received before I EVER did any install. (Stash does not think about retail and dealer cost)

2) If I knew the issues I would have with my C4 dealer I CERTAINLY would have goes with Crestron.

3) As a Crestron dealer my total caost is about 75% less then the price I quoted above since I do not have to pay for programming and my hardware costs as a dealer is a lot less than retail (Think McFly Think)

4) The pricing I quoted in this thread is for a BASIC system AV control system. No lights, HVAC, etc. The thread you are quoting me from is NOT a basic install.

Again, someone who does not read or at leat can read but can not think. Here I will help you.

1) This post was for a basic install

2) All the pricing from all the vendors I received PRIOR to this post was for RETAIL.

3) As far as Crestron being a bit more. I again I wanted to show that you dont need $$$$ in order to install a system as some have stated

4) I originally stated that a BASIC Crestron system would run about $2,500. I then stated that I can still go down in price to $1,900.00. A price that was "in the same ballpark" as C4. Not the same price, not less, not $$$$ more.

Now go and think of a response, come back and post it and I will correct you again. Because my money is placed on the fact that you will still not understand.

GoGo Delicious.

[GoGo Delicious]

HEY . . I thought I told you class was dismissed :mad:

Why be so condescending.

Because Johnny you STILL do not get it. So let me DUMB IT DOWN EVEN MORE FOR YOU. (As Ratt once said "Your back for more")

I contend you suffer from amnesia or maybe you should go back to school yourself. I guess you spew so much bullshit that you can't remember your own posts uh? Obviously you are the one who didn't like my post and got huffy, after all, you wrote a BS thesis that doesn't prove anything accept that you think you are better than everyone else. Hopefully you will treat your customers better.

Class this is what we know as keyboard litter. It's when a student has not done his homework (As in Johnnys case) and needs to fill in blank space so it looks like he knows more then he actually does. Usually these type of people are known as "Know it alls" In a few minutes I will show you class how important it is to a good education and the importance of reading.

By the way class, this is know as a Forum Post NOT a thesis. Johnny may think it's a thesis because this is the most he ever writes or trys to read but it's not. It's just a Thread, on a Forum.

take a look...Post #9 in this thread http://www.c4forums.com/viewtopic.php?id=1090. Here it is just in case. Doesn't sound like you had chosen Crestron yet at this point and doesn't it sound like having some control over your system is important? First quote is from rant above, 2nd quote below is from Post #9.

Get your paper and pencil out Johnny (No pen for you). You will need to take notes since you did not learn your lesson from above.

One of two things here. 1) You either do not read very well OR you lack total comprehension, maybe even both who knows. At any rate, I NEVER said, in any of my posts that, having programming control was important. In fact I already chose Crestron when I began to think about programming. Having programming control was NEVER a consideration in my decsion. You need to READ CAREFULLY (Come On Johnny Pay Attention).

No problem. My wife keeps asking em the same thing. She's pushing for Crestron.

My main reason for staying are as follows.

1) I do have access to the software to do all the programming. If I move to Crestron or any other HA system I lose that. I don't want to call the dealer/installer every time I want to make a change, add a new product (AV, Audio, etc), want to add a key pad/switch.

Now class what Jonny has proven is that he can quote but can not read (Ms. Johnny's mom, has Johnny been checked for dyslexia?) NO WHERE do I say that, according to you "having some control over your system is important" Again you are mis-quoting me. (Johnny, this is knowing as lying, or spreading false information, and will not be tolerated).

I did sate that "I do have access to the software to do all the programming. If I move to Crestron or any other HA system I lose that. I don't want to call the dealer/installer every time I want to make a change, add a new product (AV, Audio, etc), want to add a key pad/switch." because the Control4 dealer was soooo incompetent. I needed the software in order to get the C4 system functioning. Can you imagine a C4 end user, who does NOT have the means to aquire the programming software, being in the same boat as me. If you read the ENTIRE thread that you are quoting from it also states ". . . at this point I am going with Crestron in our main house and for now leaving C4 in the guest house" in fact I state that Im going to Crestron (for our main house) twice in that thread. That decsion was made PRIOR to getting a Crestron dealership and 2) knowing I was NOT going to have the programming software. So again Johnny please read carefully and try to avoid mis-quoting.

Do I need to say anymore about the credibility or lack thereof of your personal attack, gogo?

Johnny, I think you are confused. When you mis-quote YOU loose credibility. I know you do not read well and you lack comprehension so I will repete myself. Now class what Jonny has proven is that he can quote but can not read (Ms. Johnny's mom, has Johnny been checked for dyslexia?) NO WHERE do I say that, according to you "having some control over your system is important" Again you are mis-quoting me. (Johnny, this is knowing as lying, or spreading false information, and will not be tolerated).

Good luck with your business, i hope you obtain all the success that you deserve.

Thanks. I appreciate that very much and I am serious about that.

On a side note. I found a C4 dealer that SEEMS, and I do stress SEEMS, to be up to par to fix the C4 system in the guest house. The system works OK but alot of the functions that should be working are not. Anyways, just to do the,re-programming and get the system to work properly it's going to run about $2,100.00. So my total investment will $5,000 (Initial hardware cost, installation, and programming) + $2,100.00 (programming to fix the original dealers errors and to get the system functioning properly) Total $ 7,100.00. After I get the main house completed I will be moving the C4 system to ether to my studio (music) or to our show room so we can give a side by side demo. Who knows, I might eve put it on ebay.

GoGo Delicious

P.S. Ignore spelling and grammer. I am too tired to proof read right now.

[lvs]

Let's see, what can I write now that makes GoGo spend so much of his time trying to justify his superiority and making everyone else feel inferior? It seems the only person filling in information is GoGo.

does anyone even care?

[wingzz]

Let's see, what can I write now that makes GoGo spend so much of his time trying to justify his superiority and making everyone else feel inferior? It seems the only person filling in information is GoGo.

does anyone even care?

Why bother ?? he is starting to act like a real idiot around here, do we have an ignore function on this board???

[AJF]

What a pompous asshole. Maybe he should buy this forum and ban everyone that disagrees with him. He'll be talking to himself.

[read99]

This guy is an obvious troll.

[Paul_Quadriom]

GoGo Delicious, I think you've made your pointS here and in about 2 other threads. Good luck with Crestron and with your companies.

Now that you no longer use C4 for your enjoyment and convenience, I think it's time to GoGo away quietly.

Admin, please lock this thread down, we've read enough.

[GoGo Delicious]

GoGo Delicious, I think you've made your pointS here and in about 2 other threads. Good luck with Crestron and with your companies.

Now that you no longer use C4 for your enjoyment and convenience, I think it's time to GoGo away quietly.

Admin, please lock this thread down, we've read enough.

Again . . A person who can not read. This person is like the 4 people who posted above him. Did you read what I said or are you just reacting, like the 4 above you? You state

Now that you no longer use C4 for your enjoyment and convenience, I think it's time to GoGo away quietly.

Again READ AND COMPREHEND I said

"On a side note. I found a C4 dealer that SEEMS, and I do stress SEEMS, to be up to par to fix the C4 system in the guest house. The system works OK but alot of the functions that should be working are not. Anyways, just to do the,re-programming and get the system to work properly it's going to run about $2,100.00. So my total investment will $5,000 (Initial hardware cost, installation, and programming) + $2,100.00 (programming to fix the original dealers errors and to get the system functioning properly) Total $ 7,100.00."

I also stated " After I get the main house completed I will be moving the C4 system to ether to my studio (music) or to our show room so we can give a side by side demo. Who knows, I might eve put it on ebay."

If I move it to my studio OR showroom I will still be a C4 user. As far as Ebay goes, I highly doubt that I will sell it on ebay.

So again, you state "Now that you no longer use C4" which is totally false. Don't follow the other sheep above you who cannot read or comprehend. I never said I am no longer using C4.

GoGo Delicous.

[wingzz]

Ok well still GoGo away anyway